I suppose it has to be said that a lot of cast-iron penalties haven't been given at St Mary's this season and we have had the rub of the green in that most would have been against us! The first one was identical to one Spurs WERE given in the last thirty seconds of their match!!

One other point - and I will duck for cover after saying this: Does all the abuse and negativity about opposition players etc actually help us during the game? Do our team feel properly supported when half the crowd are looking at the opposition? The way to make our point is surely to win on the field and then celebrate afterwards. Unless our players themselves have a point to prove (ala Hoddle) then I think it hinders rather than helps our cause during the game itself. Lallana will have probably made friendships at Saints with players on the field for us yesterday. I know it would probably make no difference either way but I clearly remember the 1-2 vs QPR on Arry's first return. Some Saints supporters spent the whole game looking at the dug-out. That's not supporting the team in my book.

The second penalty on Djuricic could've been given twice, as he was first fouled by Allen and then bundled over by Lovren. Referee decisions (good and bad) are part of the game, but it's pretty unfortunate when 4 go against you in 45 mins.
Aside from that, it goes without saying that things up front don't seem to be working at the moment. Pelle looks like a tortured soul at times and needs everyone to rally around him to get his confidence back. Also, I wonder how many goals we've scored from set-pieces this season? Not many, I reckon. Yesterday we had 6 corners and a 5 or so free kicks in decent areas but produced nothing. Maybe teams are better at defending set-pieces now, but we seem especially wasteful of those opportunities. This is odd seeing as JWP is hailed as a great set-piece taker and we've got some tall and strong players in the box.

On the plus side, we played well against a good Liverpool team and matched them in all areas - just like in the first meeting. Yoshida played well again, as did Vic, and Mane looked lively when he came on. If we play like that against West Brom we'll get a result

I feel sorry for Pellè he had some lovely touches yesterday early in the game. He needs support perhaps two up font - Mané if he can improve his time keeping or Long if his ribs are not causing him pain.

Tadić needs to be on the left wing where he was so effective early in the season.

Having Betrand back will improve our attack. Matt Target has done well, unfortunate with their second goal.

Don't despair - onwards and upwards, we now need to get back dispatching all the teams outside the big six starting with West Brom and Crystal Palace, six points will put us back.

Our set pieces are interesting. Obviously Toby scored from a corner at Palace and there have been a couple of others but given the height in our side we don't seem to have as much success as we should.

When JWP is off we don't have anyone who can deliver a decent cross into the box. But I even think JWP might need to look at his delivery. Because he tries to get it in so flat and so fast he often fails to clear the first man and he has delivered some real stinkers this season. Trying to get it in so flat means it is very difficult to find your man, I would almost prefer a little less ambition and just getting it into the danger area every time.

Absolutely correct SanMarco.What point is there in paying £30 to £40 just to shout abuse? Including Lovren was a shrewd move on the part of Brenda and it succeeded in taking the crowds attention away from the game itself thus reducing our supporters encouragement of our team.

The ref was poor but not solely to blame for our defeat.In the last few games we appear to want one pass too many when in front of goal a la Arsenal last season. Is ther nobody who can shoot anymore or is it that the manager does not encourage it as a tactic? You cannot walk the ball into the net on every occasion.

Forster may be a good reaction keeper but yet again he was beaten by a shot from miles away in a fashion very similar to the goal scored by Swansea.Also, to me his ability to get down to ground shots is hampered by his height.Overall is he any better than Boric,I think not.

Finally the delivery of dead balls by JWP was frankly dreadful yesterday looking to me as though he was simply trying to hard.





I thought JWP was very poor with set piece deliveries

its a shame we keep trying to walk the ball into the net every time. No one ever wants to shoot....same with past 4 games now.

saintmark76's comments on Forster are very interesting. He is certainly vulnerable to low shots in the corner (eg West Ham away, Stoke in League Cup) but I just feel that the Swansea goal and yesterday's somehow ought to have been kept out. Maybe that is unfair and as to whether he is better than Boruc - interesting question...

I'm a great admirer of Steven Davis, but I think RK got it badly wrong playing him as a defensive midfielder, when we had Schneiderlin and Reed available. Hopefully SD will be pushed further forward next week in place of Elia.

OK so I have let this one sink in and re-watched most of it again and can now confirm the following;
Ref bottled all the big decisions. 2 Duricic pens - if Kane gets that 96th main pen, then we should have had both - which would obviously mean a red card in 1st min. Lovren handball - he moved his arm down to the ball and was a pen. Keeper clearly handled outside the box and should have been off as well.
Mane screwed us today. He was due to start but got to the stadium late, forcing Ron to change tactics at the 11th hour. Fine him 2 weeks wages, but start him v West Brom.
We were good in the first half with the world against us, but didn't really do much in the second, with many players just drifting through.
There was yet again no urgency in our play. Nobody wanted the responsibility of shooting and when Pelle did shoot, it was the wrong option. We still try to walk it in.
We restricted a big club to only 4 shots on target, but just like home to Man U who only had 2 on target, we lost the game having gifted the opposition a goal. Morgan first gave the ball away with a silly pass, then Targett passed it to Sterling. It makes me think exactly how costly Bertrand's moment of madness was, 3 games ago. Targett has been OK, but not replicated the early form he show away to Arsenal and Stoke in the cup. We were crying out for a left back v Swansea, or at least someone who could cross from the left - no disrespect to Yoshi though. We didn't appeal Ryan's red card, but apparently Chelsea are appealing Matic's red. Really ? A kick and a shove to the ground in reaction to a bad tackle. If they are successful, he will be eligible to play against us, so let's hope not then.
Too many stupid passes. Yes, Morgan and Targett for the 2nd goal, but we tried too many stupid flicks that gave possession away too cheaply and Davis was rightly taken off at half time for consistently giving the ball away, or putting players under unnecessary pressure with a bad pass, or choosing the wrong option. JWP was similar and I am not sure what people see in him. Yes he had some assists earlier on, but his deliveries are poor of late and I can't see anything that justifies his place. That 2nd half free kick where he opted to pass to Duricic instead of shooting, but over hit it, summed him up yesterday. Time for him to be replaced - maybe by Tadic.
FF was not to blame. It was a worldy for the first goal, that sometimes you have say fair play to, but the second was teed up by Targett and went through a defenders legs, so he saw it late. The difference was Mignolet made saves or his defenders got in crucial blocks, despite perhaps him and Allen not deserving to be on the pitch.
It is not the end of the world. We did well against a good side - particularly in the first half, but in the second, it was us that looked like we had played a Europa League game on Thursday night.
On to West Brom then. Ron needs to make changes big time. 1 goal in 4 is poor. Perhaps if Toby is back, it will boost the team a little and get us up and running again. We seem to have too many similar players in Elia, Mane, Duricic, Tadic, Davis and JWP, so perhaps we should go back to 4 4 2, or 3 2 3 2 in order to find that winning combination again. Hopefully with Long back, he can take some pressure off Pelle, or play up top with him.
WE MARCH ON !!!

Lovren was woeful and Lallana was very quiet. I thought that this was partly due to the reaction of the crowd. Including Lovren was certainly not a shrewd move.

Apart from a great goal from Coutinho Liverpool where rubbish. We were absolutely robbed by completely cowardly refereeing. That’s why Rogers made a point of saying that he was brave in the face of a hostile crowd.

If Liverpool had gone 2-1 down and reduced to 10 they would have had no complaints.

Koeman should have done the same as Jose after the game, just read out the times of the refs mistakes. OK, the first was 50/50, but the other two were dead certs.

Here's one for the conspiracy theorists: Chelsea get no calls to drop points. ManCity is awarded a penalty at the start of the game to give them a leg up. We get no calls and drop points to a team that moves up. Spurs get a late call to give them points. Result: the top of the table is all tightened up to help the big teams and make a compelling story for the end of the season. Big Sam has a point: his team has only got one penalty call the whole season-why? Because they are not a fashionable team, or as he says, they play honestly and are punished for it.

I for one say the more abuse the better. It gets in their heads, refs as well as players. Look at Lovern yesterday him and Lallana were non-factors. That's the role of the home crowd in any sport.
Our team should not be so unprofessional and childish that they can't play well unless everyone cheers them on- they should be up for every game-score a goal, win a game! Then you will get cheers!

Speaking of scoring, we are just not taking enough shots and our dead ball game is dead. Every time I see a team take a corner or free kick I think 'they might score' Not with the Saints. Think about it: when was the last time you thought they were going to score on a free? Rickie Lambert was taking it!




I for one say the more abuse at opposing players the better. It gets in their heads-look at Lovern yesterday.

Sorry about the repetition! Trying to get work done and rant is not easy!

On the point of abusing the opposition, it was interesting that while the Saints support was singing abuse at Lovren before the kick off, Mignolet went to Lovren and gave him a pat on the back and to Lallana and to each of the outfield players. The abuse was used as a positive and served to build a bit of team spirit.

I have spoken to three neutrals and all have slightly surprised me by being firm on penalty + red for the first one. The second and third were cast-iron but I think the gk handball was too close for a ref to call.

We were certainly paid back in one go for those several pens that should have been given against us at St. Mary's.

Kelvin would have saved Couthinos shot. Trouble is he wouldn't have come from the resultant corner and Liverpool would have had a free header.

Why the fuss over the refused penalties? ? We did actually miss our last one - at Burnley.
Coyr.
Second place looking dodgy but third will do.

Gotta disagree Winchester, how many times on this site, have we discussed not booing Saints players who are off form? Because it will only make them nervous and play worse.- But booing opposing players makes them play better?

Did Mignolet pat the ref on the back before kickoff? He was the only one who gave them a positive performance.

After two days of considered reflection, I am still seething at the worst Ref display I have seen in a long time. I am more annoyed than when Diago Forlan was allowed to continue playing with his shirt in his hand or the when the Arsenal “Invincibles” rescued a 2-2 draw in inexplicable extra time.

Apart from that, we are not scoring because teams are playing a high line to combat Pelle. This has allowed our quicker players to get through and has resulted in at least 3 incidents that should have been punished. Its no coincidence that Adrián was sent off and Mignolet should have been.

Start with Long and Pelle against west brom and the 3 points are ours. COYRs