| We need a Director of Football 09:19 - Apr 6 with 30003 views | Blue_Castello |
Now I can understand why combining the two jobs of CEO and DOF is a significant cost saving to the club and if you had the right person in the position with significant experience it could work. That person could set the overall strategy for the club ensure it is implemented and not have somebody else telling them to go in a different direction.
However we don't have an experienced CEO and we are paying the price, the issues with recruitment have been highlighted in previews and reports, the imbalance of the squad and the debatable purchases which appear to have been purely analytical driven.
We are currently competing against teams who understand the physicality of the Championship and if you can't match them then you are struggling before the kick off. It feels like the squads been put together by somebody sitting in front of a terminal looking at statistics and not trying to balance the needs of a squad that has to play sometimes 3 games in a week. The point was made by Kevin Gallen on the WLS podcast, the players from the overseas leagues do not have the same loading on the playing schedule and this can reflect in them not being so robust.
Surely enough time has been given to see if the cost saving would work with only one man in charge and we now need to bite the bullet and get a DOF before it's too late. It may not even cost the club a fortune, if we can find a Senior person who has experience of the Championship then they could be employed part time. It would be a difficult appointment to make because they have to work in harmony with the CEO but that's for the board to sort out.
There will possibly be cost savings with a reorganisation it happens in a lot of business when they are restructured, should we really be paying some bloke based in Dubai for consultancy.
Made me smile thinking of Uncle Neil coming back on a part time basis, I think his time has gone but he knew how to put a squad together, that's what we need somebody who understands the demands of the physicality of the Championship and we recruit players who are robust and less prone to injury.
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| We need a Director of Football on 20:46 - Apr 6 with 2090 views | PunteR |
| We need a Director of Football on 20:09 - Apr 6 by Superhoops2808 |
What makes me chuckle is how Sir Les was hounded out by most of the fan base, and now we are crying out for someone like him
There is that warning about being careful what you wish for and now it appears we are heading in the same direction all over again |
Who's crying out for someone like him. ? |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 20:52 - Apr 6 with 2069 views | lassel |
| We need a Director of Football on 17:29 - Apr 6 by stevec |
That would be a problem.
I appreciate the consensus amongst supporters is Nourry has been calling the shots regards transfers but I notice we’ve been bringing in players largely, certainly for us, from what you might call second tier European countries over the last year or so and we’d never really gone that route before. It may be coincidence, but a bloody big coincidence, but didn’t Marti come to town from the very same European leagues not more than a few months before these signings were made. As such, it seems somewhat unlikely that he didn’t play a significant role in these particular signings and there’s been a fair few of them.
This brings me to probably our most successful signing in the last year, Morrison. One of the few, possible only signing, from our shores. Does anyone know if he was Marti’s or Nourry’s or maybe even someone else’s recommendation.
I have a feeling the scorn for Nourry might not be so constant if we knew the truth. |
The Home Office relaxed the post-Brexit rules summer of 2023 which opened up markets that were no-go’s for a few years where you were only allowed one ‘joker’ who didn’t qualify for a work permit.
As said before, Nourry isn’t per se to blame for recruitment, that is up to Belk and his large team of ‘performance analysts’. As CEO, DOF, writer, producer and lead pianist however it does ultimately fall on his head.
As for Cifuentes, I can’t speak for his whole career, but certainly at Aab, Hammarby and at QPR, recruitment has simply not been part of his remit. At Hammarby it was ultimately my wife’s responsibility along with the DOF at the time. | | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 21:23 - Apr 6 with 1979 views | colinallcars |
| We need a Director of Football on 20:52 - Apr 6 by lassel |
The Home Office relaxed the post-Brexit rules summer of 2023 which opened up markets that were no-go’s for a few years where you were only allowed one ‘joker’ who didn’t qualify for a work permit.
As said before, Nourry isn’t per se to blame for recruitment, that is up to Belk and his large team of ‘performance analysts’. As CEO, DOF, writer, producer and lead pianist however it does ultimately fall on his head.
As for Cifuentes, I can’t speak for his whole career, but certainly at Aab, Hammarby and at QPR, recruitment has simply not been part of his remit. At Hammarby it was ultimately my wife’s responsibility along with the DOF at the time. |
That's what it's always seemed to me - Marti doesn't look a happy bunny with what he has to work with.
There are times when the team looks greater than the sum of its parts, but then it all breaks down again. |  | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 21:49 - Apr 6 with 1910 views | macclesfieldman |
IMO we are being too short sighted saying our transfer dealings have been poor. They have been mixed, some good (Nardi, Varane, Morrison, Saito), some poor
( Madsen, Celar) and some too early to tell ( Dembele, Morgan).
That's no different to previous regimes ( Dykes, Washington, Dozell)
I still back Noury but am a bit on the fence re Marti |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 22:14 - Apr 6 with 1861 views | 1JD |
| We need a Director of Football on 21:49 - Apr 6 by macclesfieldman |
IMO we are being too short sighted saying our transfer dealings have been poor. They have been mixed, some good (Nardi, Varane, Morrison, Saito), some poor
( Madsen, Celar) and some too early to tell ( Dembele, Morgan).
That's no different to previous regimes ( Dykes, Washington, Dozell)
I still back Noury but am a bit on the fence re Marti |
If you do it on money spent, not on player volume, and success per spend - as any good recruitment operation is judged by - it changes considerably to the negative.
The big money marquee signings have been total flops and will affect our club for years to come. Making a mistake on a dev squad player, like a Bennie, is not the same as a multi-million one in Madsen. Everything is not created equal.
When you finally get to spend money, like we did this year, you just cannot be getting the big ones wrong. | | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 22:20 - Apr 6 with 1840 views | numptydumpty |
This bloke called Les seems to have a connection with the club and a will to succeed.
The treatment of Sir Les by most on here was an utter disgrace !!!
But hey ho, such is life !!! |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 22:20 - Apr 6 with 1843 views | Hunterhoop |
Not being open to any form of challenge is a serious concern for a leader, especially an inexperienced and young one. He’s learning on our time and at the club’s expense.
What I find amazing is that everyone who has met him comes away with a negative view, certainly not a positive one.
I would also add - and you can ignore me if you want - Nourry is Hoos’ man. He brought him in as he was his ticket to semi retirement. He’s Chairman but he is only part time. He’s coaching Nourry on the CEO stuff but leaving him to fulfil the DOF responsibilities as he pleases. So very hard to argue, especially if Les was accountable, that Nourry shouldn’t be for the first team performance.
Ruben didn’t hire Nourry. Nor did Amit or Reilly. They went along with Hoos from what I understand.
And the only one of them in the country, even remotely overlooking what is going on, is Hoos.
You can spot the problem there. |  | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 22:22 - Apr 6 with 1813 views | stainrods_elbow |
| We need a Director of Football on 22:14 - Apr 6 by 1JD |
If you do it on money spent, not on player volume, and success per spend - as any good recruitment operation is judged by - it changes considerably to the negative.
The big money marquee signings have been total flops and will affect our club for years to come. Making a mistake on a dev squad player, like a Bennie, is not the same as a multi-million one in Madsen. Everything is not created equal.
When you finally get to spend money, like we did this year, you just cannot be getting the big ones wrong. |
Many, many clubs have got the 'big ones' wrong over the years - higher up the football food chain, think of Fashanu (and Stan the Man) at Forest; Collymore at Liverpool; Mutu at the Scum; and Birtles (and far too many others in recent times to shake a stick at) at Manure - and that's just a few names off the top of my head.
Our recruitment has been mixed, and Celar and Madsen have disappointed majorly, though it's not impossible - if perhaps unlikely - the former may yet come good. And said recruitment, as I shall keep reminding all those who still don't want to recognise the evidence, is a reflection of the collective decisions of Nourry, Belk and Marti, not some one-man sh*tshow! |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 23:06 - Apr 6 with 1752 views | PunteR |
| We need a Director of Football on 22:20 - Apr 6 by numptydumpty |
This bloke called Les seems to have a connection with the club and a will to succeed.
The treatment of Sir Les by most on here was an utter disgrace !!!
But hey ho, such is life !!! |
By most on here?
I think most on here gave him loads of support. For years. Yes there were a few mutterings of jobs for the boys etc and he had critics , which goes with the territory.
His time had run its course. He didn't get hounded out, he left because the board decided to get Ainsworth in , which he disagreed on. And he was right. He had his time to turn the club around and he never really fulfilled it , just got us treading water for years. Some might say that's an achievement in itself.
I bet if he could have his time here again , he would do things different. [Post edited 6 Apr 23:07]
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| We need a Director of Football on 23:07 - Apr 6 with 1737 views | GaryHaddock |
| We need a Director of Football on 20:45 - Apr 6 by 1JD |
Probably was a 9/10 if they had run the process effectively. Doesn’t take a lot to analyse DOF performance across Europe, find a few up and coming ones, and create a short list.
Instead, they gave it to a guy a couple of years out of uni, with not even a permanent job to his name. No background in managing people or teams. And literally no background in anything. |
So, I’ve got no qualms in principle of young and upcoming talent (playing, coaching, corporate) using QPR to prove themselves and then making a bigger move like Venables or Eze did.
I just don’t think that Nourry is a talent, and apart from a few leather enthusiasts, he’s alienated himself from the fans by lying about his CV and the paranoia around comms as has been said over and over again.
I can sort of forgive the results because this club is limited, and he’s only been doing the job for a year but the rest of it is not indicative of talent is it? Just ego and hubris which just won’t fly when you are brand new to the industry and need to make friends and influence people. [Post edited 6 Apr 23:14]
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| We need a Director of Football on 23:12 - Apr 6 with 1715 views | PunteR |
| We need a Director of Football on 23:07 - Apr 6 by GaryHaddock |
So, I’ve got no qualms in principle of young and upcoming talent (playing, coaching, corporate) using QPR to prove themselves and then making a bigger move like Venables or Eze did.
I just don’t think that Nourry is a talent, and apart from a few leather enthusiasts, he’s alienated himself from the fans by lying about his CV and the paranoia around comms as has been said over and over again.
I can sort of forgive the results because this club is limited, and he’s only been doing the job for a year but the rest of it is not indicative of talent is it? Just ego and hubris which just won’t fly when you are brand new to the industry and need to make friends and influence people. [Post edited 6 Apr 23:14]
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You can do that if the infrastructure is in place and already a well run club, but were not. We're having to start from the ground up every year. | |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| We need a Director of Football on 23:23 - Apr 6 with 1686 views | KensalT |
| We need a Director of Football on 23:07 - Apr 6 by GaryHaddock |
So, I’ve got no qualms in principle of young and upcoming talent (playing, coaching, corporate) using QPR to prove themselves and then making a bigger move like Venables or Eze did.
I just don’t think that Nourry is a talent, and apart from a few leather enthusiasts, he’s alienated himself from the fans by lying about his CV and the paranoia around comms as has been said over and over again.
I can sort of forgive the results because this club is limited, and he’s only been doing the job for a year but the rest of it is not indicative of talent is it? Just ego and hubris which just won’t fly when you are brand new to the industry and need to make friends and influence people. [Post edited 6 Apr 23:14]
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Terry Venables had proven himself at Palace before he came here:
https://www.football.london/crystal-palace-fc/news/rise-fall-crystal-palaces-tea
Beggars belief that Ron Noades planned to remove him (and sacked Dario Gradi the same season). And then he allowed half of Tel's golden boys to follow him here from Palace.
But deep down Noades wanted to do all the jobs himself and had a caretaker stint at Palace before chairing and then managing our friends in Hounslow:
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/ron-noades/profil/trainer/105570
Some people want to write the theme tune, sing the theme tune, etc when they really ought to concentrate on mastering one job first. [Post edited 6 Apr 23:42]
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| We need a Director of Football on 00:22 - Apr 7 with 1579 views | Nov77 |
Good article in the times today on Benham over at Brentford. What a difference having someone with a plan and some nous to what we've had over the years. Shocking.
We are going nowhere under these owners.
Rumour is they told nourry/cifuentes ‘we want a trophy”
Nobody at the club knew what this ‘trophy’ thing was, so they looked it up in the dictionary……
“ atrophy “ meaning…..gradually decline in effectiveness or vigour due to underuse or neglect.
Synonyms: wasting away, decline, decay, decaying, withering, deterioration
“There you go boss, atrophy”
“Boss?” |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 07:40 - Apr 7 with 1400 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
| We need a Director of Football on 22:22 - Apr 6 by stainrods_elbow |
Many, many clubs have got the 'big ones' wrong over the years - higher up the football food chain, think of Fashanu (and Stan the Man) at Forest; Collymore at Liverpool; Mutu at the Scum; and Birtles (and far too many others in recent times to shake a stick at) at Manure - and that's just a few names off the top of my head.
Our recruitment has been mixed, and Celar and Madsen have disappointed majorly, though it's not impossible - if perhaps unlikely - the former may yet come good. And said recruitment, as I shall keep reminding all those who still don't want to recognise the evidence, is a reflection of the collective decisions of Nourry, Belk and Marti, not some one-man sh*tshow! |
Absolutely laughable examples here. Two of them happened before I was born and I’m a middle aged grey haired father.
1JD’s excellent point was relative to Championship P&S rules and he’s spot on. The Madsen and Celar transfer fees will now hamstring us for three years unless we can get some money back for them.
None of your examples happened in the Championship, three of them are from a different century and even the ‘modern’ one happened before any such sustainability rules came in and by a club that essentially can opt out of them. |  | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 08:11 - Apr 7 with 1337 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| We need a Director of Football on 21:49 - Apr 6 by macclesfieldman |
IMO we are being too short sighted saying our transfer dealings have been poor. They have been mixed, some good (Nardi, Varane, Morrison, Saito), some poor
( Madsen, Celar) and some too early to tell ( Dembele, Morgan).
That's no different to previous regimes ( Dykes, Washington, Dozell)
I still back Noury but am a bit on the fence re Marti |
Fair play, Macclesfield.
I think you're obviously right that it's too early to tell in some cases.
As of now, I'm not as high on some of the deals as you are, but hopefully a couple will settle. My main concern, though, is the balance of the squad and the lack of depth in a few key areas - left-back, right-back, midfield, strikers.
After all, we did have a really good spell when we had enough fit players. It's the lack of depth that's killed us. |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 08:32 - Apr 7 with 1285 views | SteveW6 |
| We need a Director of Football on 07:40 - Apr 7 by Padulas_Shampoo |
Absolutely laughable examples here. Two of them happened before I was born and I’m a middle aged grey haired father.
1JD’s excellent point was relative to Championship P&S rules and he’s spot on. The Madsen and Celar transfer fees will now hamstring us for three years unless we can get some money back for them.
None of your examples happened in the Championship, three of them are from a different century and even the ‘modern’ one happened before any such sustainability rules came in and by a club that essentially can opt out of them. |
High profile examples, not laughable.
This isn't Football Manager where you can guarantee a player will be a success at any club and beyond the examples given every club does make mistakes in the transfer market and every club will continue to do so.
Also, the system that identified Madsen and Frey is the same one that identified Marti.
We are, however, under additional pressure when signings do go wrong. We're already shopping in the bargain section and getting 3rd or 4th dibs on players so the mistakes will be cruelly exposed. | | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 08:43 - Apr 7 with 1259 views | stevec |
| We need a Director of Football on 21:49 - Apr 6 by macclesfieldman |
IMO we are being too short sighted saying our transfer dealings have been poor. They have been mixed, some good (Nardi, Varane, Morrison, Saito), some poor
( Madsen, Celar) and some too early to tell ( Dembele, Morgan).
That's no different to previous regimes ( Dykes, Washington, Dozell)
I still back Noury but am a bit on the fence re Marti |
That’s fair comment.
Think the real problem is the system we play clearly doesn’t work for any of our attack minded players.
Dembele could be a dangerous player in the right team, Morgan was decent but again we’re not using him to our advantage. Andersen has gone downhill this season but in the second half of last season he had players around him where he could do what he does best, pick a pass forward, that option has all but disappeared for him this season and that’s him basically rendered impotent.
Whoever is fixated on this 3-1 front line is wearing a blind fold and if that’s also on Nourry then this is a very strange football club. |  | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 09:56 - Apr 7 with 1151 views | TheChef |
| We need a Director of Football on 11:28 - Apr 6 by johnhoop |
Staggering really that Ruben should have fallen for it. It’s on a par with Mark Hughes interviewing QPR, Redknapp dazzling Fernandes with his bovine excrement and Beale with his power point.
You’d have thought they would have known how to spot a bullsh-tter by now as they’ve had so much experience of them. |
Hoos wanted out - and Nourry was his out. |  |
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| We need a Director of Football on 10:17 - Apr 7 with 1110 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
| We need a Director of Football on 08:32 - Apr 7 by SteveW6 |
High profile examples, not laughable.
This isn't Football Manager where you can guarantee a player will be a success at any club and beyond the examples given every club does make mistakes in the transfer market and every club will continue to do so.
Also, the system that identified Madsen and Frey is the same one that identified Marti.
We are, however, under additional pressure when signings do go wrong. We're already shopping in the bargain section and getting 3rd or 4th dibs on players so the mistakes will be cruelly exposed. |
Well excusing paying multi million pounds in the P&S rule era on a player so ill equipped for the Championship as Nico Madsen by saying Nottingham Forest bought Justin Fashanu in 1981 or Manchester United bought Gary Birtles in 1980 made me laugh.
I don't expect every signing to be incredible. The fact that the two highest outlays have been two of our poorer performers is inexcusable though. In hindsight it reeks of desperation and / or incompetence. You could have spent 10% of those fees on players that would have had similar impacts on our season. The Madsen signing in particular is a disaster and as previously stated if we can't get money back on him the dent the fee makes in our P&S will impact the next three seasons. If you can't be pretty damn sure the player you're getting is an investment at that transfer fee, don't buy him. It's inexcusable. | | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:26 - Apr 7 with 1086 views | SteveW6 |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:17 - Apr 7 by Padulas_Shampoo |
Well excusing paying multi million pounds in the P&S rule era on a player so ill equipped for the Championship as Nico Madsen by saying Nottingham Forest bought Justin Fashanu in 1981 or Manchester United bought Gary Birtles in 1980 made me laugh.
I don't expect every signing to be incredible. The fact that the two highest outlays have been two of our poorer performers is inexcusable though. In hindsight it reeks of desperation and / or incompetence. You could have spent 10% of those fees on players that would have had similar impacts on our season. The Madsen signing in particular is a disaster and as previously stated if we can't get money back on him the dent the fee makes in our P&S will impact the next three seasons. If you can't be pretty damn sure the player you're getting is an investment at that transfer fee, don't buy him. It's inexcusable. |
Is it inexcusable or what can happen when you're buying cheap?
Also, as above, you can never be sure that you're going to get money back on a player. If they're a huge success you will but you can't guarantee that so it's a gamble. | | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:51 - Apr 7 with 1040 views | KensalT |
| We need a Director of Football on 08:32 - Apr 7 by SteveW6 |
High profile examples, not laughable.
This isn't Football Manager where you can guarantee a player will be a success at any club and beyond the examples given every club does make mistakes in the transfer market and every club will continue to do so.
Also, the system that identified Madsen and Frey is the same one that identified Marti.
We are, however, under additional pressure when signings do go wrong. We're already shopping in the bargain section and getting 3rd or 4th dibs on players so the mistakes will be cruelly exposed. |
"Also, the system that identified Madsen and Frey is the same one that identified Marti."
I have got to disagree with you there.
Marti was recruited at a time when we had one vacancy to fill (two if you include Xavi Calm as his assistant).
In the summer we tore up the whole squad sheet. Established first team players like Lyndon and Sincs were sold and effectively a third of a new squad was brought in (and most of those had never played in England and none had played in the Championship)
Plugging a gap in an organisation is a lot easier than tearing up the whole organisation and undertaking a major overhaul.
Bringing in an experienced manager who has had a degree of success in several different countries and whose career is on the up is not the same as throwing together a group of players who have never played in this league and hoping there's enough experience in the changing room to ensure the newbies quickly learn to swim instead of all sinking.
You can tick off individuals and grade them as successes or failures, but as a collective group they struggle to get more than "could do better".
If it had worked we would be praising the club for it's enterprise and vision, but clearly it hasn't. In hindsight it looks like too much too soon.
And now we're going into another summer where it appears a lot of the adults in the room are out of contract and could be leaving.
Hopefully the mistakes of last summer have been learned and we don't end up with another unbalanced squad but this time without enough experience to get them through it. [Post edited 7 Apr 11:08]
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| We need a Director of Football on 10:51 - Apr 7 with 1038 views | lassel |
| We need a Director of Football on 08:32 - Apr 7 by SteveW6 |
High profile examples, not laughable.
This isn't Football Manager where you can guarantee a player will be a success at any club and beyond the examples given every club does make mistakes in the transfer market and every club will continue to do so.
Also, the system that identified Madsen and Frey is the same one that identified Marti.
We are, however, under additional pressure when signings do go wrong. We're already shopping in the bargain section and getting 3rd or 4th dibs on players so the mistakes will be cruelly exposed. |
I mean there wasn’t much scouting involved with Frey, he was available and willing to play for essentially nothing for 6 months. The owners of the database his agent listed him on made a big deal of us using it to sign him.
And with Madsen, it’s clear that he pings a lot of KPI’s in the data as several clubs at this level looked at him. The failure there was not bothering to go and actually see him play in person rather than how he looks in the powerpivots.
The big concern for me is simply do you trust the guys who signed Madsen to replace Cifuentes. | | | |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:55 - Apr 7 with 1025 views | PunteR |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:26 - Apr 7 by SteveW6 |
Is it inexcusable or what can happen when you're buying cheap?
Also, as above, you can never be sure that you're going to get money back on a player. If they're a huge success you will but you can't guarantee that so it's a gamble. |
When you are buying cheap then more due diligence is needed. As we've seen repeatedly at this club it never seems the case. Yes it's easy to say things in hindsight but we're talking multi millions of pounds at stake and some decisions just look knee jerk. Everything is disjointed. There's no excuses for Madsen and Celar. Terrible players. Or the culture isn't right behind the scenes, which is also possible. | |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| We need a Director of Football on 10:57 - Apr 7 with 1014 views | PunteR |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:17 - Apr 7 by Padulas_Shampoo |
Well excusing paying multi million pounds in the P&S rule era on a player so ill equipped for the Championship as Nico Madsen by saying Nottingham Forest bought Justin Fashanu in 1981 or Manchester United bought Gary Birtles in 1980 made me laugh.
I don't expect every signing to be incredible. The fact that the two highest outlays have been two of our poorer performers is inexcusable though. In hindsight it reeks of desperation and / or incompetence. You could have spent 10% of those fees on players that would have had similar impacts on our season. The Madsen signing in particular is a disaster and as previously stated if we can't get money back on him the dent the fee makes in our P&S will impact the next three seasons. If you can't be pretty damn sure the player you're getting is an investment at that transfer fee, don't buy him. It's inexcusable. |
Well excusing paying multi million pounds in the P&S rule era on a player so ill equipped for the Championship as Nico Madsen by saying Nottingham Forest bought Justin Fashanu in 1981 or Manchester United bought Gary Birtles in 1980 made me laugh.
Yeh, that was funny. | |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| We need a Director of Football on 11:01 - Apr 7 with 1002 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
| We need a Director of Football on 10:26 - Apr 7 by SteveW6 |
Is it inexcusable or what can happen when you're buying cheap?
Also, as above, you can never be sure that you're going to get money back on a player. If they're a huge success you will but you can't guarantee that so it's a gamble. |
That’s the point… he wasn’t cheap. The basis of my entire argument. | | | |
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